Book Marketing Tips and Author Success Podcast
Ready to supercharge your author journey? Join bestselling author and book marketing maven Penny Sansevieri and savvy publishing insider Amy Cornell for lively, no-nonsense conversations filled with smart strategies, creative inspiration, and publishing know-how you can actually use.
Whether you’re self-published, traditionally published, or somewhere in between, this podcast delivers real-world advice to help you sell more books, build your platform, and thrive in the ever-evolving publishing landscape. From clever promo hacks to critical industry insights, each episode is designed to move the needle on your success.
Fresh ideas. Actionable tips. Unfiltered talk.
If you’re serious about your author career, hit subscribe and tune in—your next big breakthrough could be one episode away.
Book Marketing Tips and Author Success Podcast
The Marketing Shift You Can't Afford to Ignore
What if the biggest thing holding your book back isn’t the algorithm or your ad budget—but your attachment to a specific outcome? We dig into the hidden cost of expectation-driven marketing and show how to swap emotional gambling for a strategy that compounds. From launch-day myths to social comparison traps, we unpack the subtle ways authors derail progress and offer a practical reset rooted in consistency, curiosity, and clear execution.
We start by challenging the instant gratification mindset that indie publishing can unintentionally fuel. Launch day is just 24 hours; real traction is cumulative. You’ll hear how to ground your plan in what you can control. We walk through why sequencing matters.
Mindset shifts take center stage: detaching through curiosity, treating no and silence as data, and limiting comparison triggers from author groups and glossy posts without receipts. We break down micro wins that actually move the needle and explain why both fiction and nonfiction sales hinge on timing and intent.
If you’re ready to trade rush for rhythm, this conversation gives you concrete steps and the mental framework to stay committed. Subscribe, share this with an author friend who needs a reset, and leave a review to tell us the one expectation you’re letting go of this week.
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Hello and welcome back to the book marketing tips and authors success podcast. This is Eddie Stance Varyl, Amy Cornell, and I'm really excited about this episode. I know we've talked about this in the green room. Um, I'm excited because we hear this, we hear this all the time when authors get overly attached to outcomes. And look, we're not saying that we don't want you to have author goals and all the things, but I think we want to turn the conversation of the attachment outcomes a little bit on its head because a lot of it doesn't really serve the authors very well. I mean, would you agree?
SPEAKER_00:Right, yes. I mean, it's where should your validation be coming from? And this also speaks to book marketing is about consistency. Success in publishing is about consistency. And if you determine your success based on has this happened by now, has this happened by now, has this happened by now, you're missing out on the things that are going to plan or things that you could better focus on. Right. And it's easy to get derailed and frustrated. You know, I think a lot of the frustration comes from showing up with certain expectations that are just honestly not realistic for the industry, you know. So it's not even about like, no, you need to squash some of those goals. It's quite literally a lot of times expectations are just developed out of thin air and they're not grounded in what's really working in the market.
SPEAKER_01:Well, but the other piece of it though, too, is that, and and this is, and we are gonna give you, so we're gonna talk both about what this looks like. So you can say, oh my gosh, yes, this is something that I absolutely do. We're also gonna talk about some solutions to this issue because the problem is that social media and author communities specifically they magnify the comparison stuff and the success envy. Um, and that's and I've said this before, and I'm gonna repeat it again in the episode because we it's worth repeating, is uh I I'm not opposed to author communities, but the problem is is that there's a lot of sharing of huge, big, impressive news and numbers and things like that. And there's you know, nobody's really bringing the receipts, so to speak. Right. So, and and the other problem is too, and when I've talked to authors before, so two problems. So publishing is not an instant gratification kind of thing, and it feels instant gratification, right? Because you can write a book and then you can hit publish on Amazon and boom, instant gratification, your book is done. Your book is done, it's up, and now you can just kind of sit back and wait for all the things to happen, right? So independent publishing to some degree has kind of fed into that instant gratification, which is unfortunate. The other piece of it, though, too, is that I talk to a lot of authors who don't really fully believe in their book. And I understand that hesitation as an author myself. I remember my first book that I published, it was it's really an emotional journey, right? And I would have dreams that people just hated my book, and it was awful. And if any of you have ever experienced that, like you are my people because you totally like so there's a lot of that kind of hesitation because it's a deeply personal project, right? So we as authors oftentimes we look for external proof, and that external proof, when that doesn't happen, that undermines everything that we do. And I've actually had authors literally with really talented authors who potentially could go do tremendous things with their career, just give up because that proof wasn't showing up within the time frame that they had determined. Like, well, I should be pitching, you know, if I pitch 20 influencers, I should get at least, you know, I mean, 18 of them should respond to me, right? You know, um, and uh the same thing is true for you know, Amazon ads or any kind of ads, like I'm running ads, I should see sales right away. You know, my I I have this slide, Amy, when I do this, when I do my book talk on book launch, and the slide set, you know, the one slide shows the golden tickets on American, um, America's got talent, like the golden, like when when when a contestant gets the golden golden buzzer and all the golden tickets fall down, right? And I'll say, um, you know, a lot of times when you launch a book, this is what you expect. And you see the person said, like, yay, golden tickets, all the things. And then the next slide says has a basically a cat holding a black balloon just standing in a corner. It's kind of depressing. That's a lot of times that's the where the way authors feel when they've launched a book. They're like, Well, I was really expecting a huge, like the golden ticket party, and basically I'm just here in a room by myself, right?
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, no, that's I actually just responded to an email that we got today about that because a very motivated fiction author. And when they wrote into us, they said, you know, and granted, when people write into us, I don't assume that they've unleashed their full scope of all their goals, all their needs, all their, you know what I mean? Like nobody wants to write that much. That's why we start the conversation. But this individual very much focused on traditional media, you know, and this is a speculative fiction author. There are things that we've done plenty of shows on media, and we will continue to do those just because we want y'all to be successful with that. But a lot of that has to do with going after the right opportunities, not just all opportunities. But anyway, so, you know, to your point, you know, when we work with this author, uh, hoping that we do, you know, we want to move forward with realistic expectations that they can feel good about in terms of what is realistic and appropriate for the market that they're writing for, you know. Right. And realistically, that is not going to be that, you know, coveted interview on today. That's just not how it works, you know. Yeah. Yeah. And exactly. I've always been very honest with authors about realistic expectations because, and I love this line attachment to specific outcomes turns marketing from strategy into emotional gambling. And I love this note that we have because I thought that is so spot on. So if you're just chasing very specific wins and not building an actual strategy and a platform and a brand that readers and even media and influencers can relate to and understand, you're missing the point.
unknown:Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:And you're going to waste a lot of time and money going after things that are never going to come together because there's too many holes in that plan.
SPEAKER_01:Well, and I think that, you know, one of the things that we talk a lot about is the learning curve. So when an author is going it alone, or even if they've hired a company and they're doing some stuff on their own, there's still a learning curve, right? And authors tell me this all the time like I learned so much with my first book that I would never do with my second. I learned so much with my first and second book that I would never do with my third. And I think that's amazing. So, you know, if you can, if you can change this language a little bit, and I'm not trying to get like all motivational woo-woo. Although I, as anybody who knows me knows I really love that stuff. I totally vibe, I totally vibe with it. But I think that, you know, as you are learning which influencers, for example, right, are the best fit, instead of I should just be getting more hits. Why am I not getting more hits? And then because that turns all the attention back on you and makes your you and your book just a big failure when really maybe it just needed more time or maybe you needed to change influencers. And that's where, and I'm gonna say this again, and I want to give a shout out because we got a review from somebody who's like, I'm starting the marketing journal thing, and I'm like, oh my gosh, you are my people. But that's really where tracking everything that you do to market your book helps you to see what worked and what what didn't. So instead of focusing on the things that you're not getting, right? You're focused, you're looking like, oh, well, I did this three weeks ago and this worked really well, and maybe I should try, you know, try that again. Right. And I also think, I mean, Amy, you know, timelines are timelines are a thing that we see authors a lot of times get, they they get very caught up in timelines. And marketing and and any kind of success in publishing is cumulative, it's never linear. And this is what when authors say to me, you know, if I work with you for 90 days or whatever, like what's gonna happen on day one? And you know, a lot of times I'm like, well, not a lot, not a lot. Like I'm flat out because it's all very cumulative, and we see this all the time, right?
SPEAKER_00:Right. And I've done a couple of reminders of that recently, and our our clients actually the responses are always very very appreciative because it is easy to get, especially because of so much that is out there, like you said, the comparison and this idea of what success is in publishing, reminding them that launch day, and not to diminish what you've been working on, but really to give you a different perspective. Launch day is just 24 hours. You know what I mean? It's here, it's gone. And can you imagine like putting all of your hopes and dreams and you know, potential for success on launch day? Yeah, no, like we would never do that to ourselves in any other aspect of our lives, right? Yet books get put in that box all the time.
SPEAKER_01:Books truly. I mean, that's like the that's like the dietary just like I'm gonna have, you know, I'm gonna have a salad for lunch and I should have lost five pounds by dinner. I mean, that it's it's kind of the same, it's a little bit the same mindset.
SPEAKER_00:Right, exactly.
SPEAKER_01:You know, but there's a lot in publishing and marketing your own book that you can't control, right? So you really have to, I mean, I we would both encourage you to stop focusing on what you can't control and and focus on what you can, right? So you can control, you know, how many pictures that you send out this week, and you can control how many bookstores that you contact. Um, but the other thing that we and this is something that I really love, Amy. I want you to to kind of take this one. The micro wins are something that I don't think that we really spend enough time talking about.
SPEAKER_00:Right. Yes. And these are, and it's interesting because wins becomes it's like you have to broaden your definition of what a win is. Yeah. You know, a win is honestly anything that you do for your book, your brand, your platform that is an improvement. And maybe that sounds super lame, but I promise you it's not. Because as we say all the time, everything is your resume that is out there for public consumption. And, you know, you're only as good as the weakest links, right? So updating your author bio, double checking your book description, is it as dynamic as it really could be? Have you asked objective third parties to read your book description and give you honest feedback? You know, we say it all the time, but it's I'll say it again a million times over. You were often way too close to your own work to be objective about your book description, about your cover. Like there's so many things that because you know it so intimately, you cannot fully put yourself in the shoes of a consumer. Yeah. Getting that outside feedback is so important. And, you know, don't try to, this is another big one. You know, don't blow all your options by pitching every blogger or influencer that you can find the first week your book is out before you have any reviews, especially if you're a new author. You know what I mean? Yeah. Like there's also, and we have done shows on this, and maybe we can revisit, you know, a fun timeline show, Penny, where we can kind of give people an idea of what goes where. But doing things in the right order also is very strategic. Yeah. And not jumping the line with the big wins, you know. So it's like, well, I want to do my pitching right away because that's the exciting stuff. I want to get coverage. But the reality is you're probably not going to get a lot of coverage if you are a new author and you don't have much of a platform and you don't have any reviews yet. You know, nobody's going to stick their neck out that much. So doing things in the right order and making sure you're showing up with a product and a retail page that is really enticing and ready to convert really is the what should be happening when your book first comes out. You know, it's not those big interviews. That is not the order of things.
SPEAKER_01:Well, and it's also, I mean, you know, when you talk about doing things in the right order, I mean, I've had authors that have said, you know, I've have they or they've they've come to us after they've done a lot of pitching on their own and they didn't have they didn't, they got no results from it. And they didn't have an author website, right? For example. Um, their retail page was not great. So, and maybe the maybe, and it could be, I I, you know, I don't know without going through their list whether or not they were even pitching the right people. So doing things in the right order is also really important. And I think um, I'm gonna go back to the journal again. I I love me some journals, man. I really, really do. Um, and notebooks, authors love their notebooks. I don't understand what we love are notebooks. Notebooks make us feel more productive. I don't know why that is, but it's the truth. Um keep a progress journal. So, you know, like an effort tracker, results tracker, um, something that you can, something that feels tangible so that you can track what you've done. Because when I talk about marketing and publicity, and I've said this to authors, if I had a dime for every time I've said this to authors in the 25 years they've been in business, I would be doing this call from my home in the south of France. A lot of what you're doing feels invisible, right? So, granted, okay, so you're pitching people so you can see the email in your outbox, like I get it, but a lot of it feels like invisible work, like you're just sending it out there into the ether and you're kind of hoping for the best. So the results tracker, effort tracker, progress journal, whatever you want to call it, really helps like, oh, I did that a month ago. That's right. I remember not only to track what worked and versus what didn't, but also so you don't forget what you did. You know?
SPEAKER_00:Yes. And we haven't mentioned it in a while, but I feel like everybody listening so far should have already seen our book marketing planner. If you haven't gotten it yet, you know, let us know, get in touch because it really is a great tool that at minimum, you know, to Penny's point, get the tracker and use it to help you outline what you want to track in your journal. You know what I mean? So if you don't want to use our version exactly as is, there's still a lot on there because, again, there are certain things that need to be done in a certain order or the foundational things that you absolutely can't neglect, but that'll also help you realize like, okay, you better not be in month four of your new books' uh existence and you haven't done a critical analysis of is my bio right? Is my description right? Can I finesse them in any way? Am I keeping my retail page updated with any uh industry reviews that I've gotten, blurbs, things like that? You know what I mean? So our our book marketing um planner is really great for as a reminder of the things that Penny's talking about that seem like they're not super sexy, they're kind of behind the scenes, and you're like, really, does this matter? It absolutely does matter.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, yeah, it absolutely does matter. Um, Amy, do you want to take the so the the mindset reset strategies, which again, I know sounds like we're going super woo down the woo-woo whole lot of but I love this stuff. Do you want to take the first one?
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, so this is great. Detach through curiosity is our first note. And, you know, instead of judging results and thinking nobody likes my book, why am I doing this? What a waste of my time. You know, figure out, you know, as Penny mentioned, look at look at your tracker. What have you been doing? What worked? What didn't? Have I been doing it long enough? You know what I mean? That's another one too. We've talked about that in the past, you know, knee jerk risk assuming something didn't work simply because it didn't meet some unrealistic expectation you put on it, you know what I mean? So, like you did a limited time discount and you didn't get a thousand downloads. You know, it's like, where did that number come from? You know, it's like, let's be realistic. But but then if you've been doing it for a while and you're not seeing any like changes in your engagement, in your downloads, in your sales, what can you do differently? How can you tweak it? And that's an important one too, Penny. I think sometimes it's tweaking, it's not completely abandoning something either, you know.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, that's very, very true. Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:Learn from it or what you can do slightly different. Because if you are implementing strategies that you've heard us talk about or that you've um picked up on from other like really solid, trusted sources in the industry, they absolutely work for some authors. You just have to determine are you doing it correctly? And sometimes, you know, is it right for my market? Because that's another thing that it's easy to fall into the trap of I read that this is a thing, so it's gotta work for me. You know, that's not always the case either.
SPEAKER_01:Right, exactly. You know, there's a lot of power in detachment. I I read a book on detachment like years ago. And of course, it's one of my woo-woo titles. I just lie that I just love, but there's so much power in detaching from an outcome that really keeps, you know, it it's also it it's detachment is much more motivating than control is, frankly. Right. The other thing is, is y'all gotta live stop comparing yourself to everyone else, right? Limit your cons can limit your comparison triggers. You know, again, I am not opposed to author Facebook groups, great metrics dashboards, things like that. Like I should be doing better, I should be doing better. A lot of these posts, they're they're not really, they're not and and and I'm not saying that everybody on Facebook is lying. Like, I don't want to go back to your group and say, Penny said y'all are lying. Like, don't don't don't be posting that. But I uh people need to bring the receipts for those posts, because I've seen that and maybe they are doing great, and you know, cheer them on. I mean, I think that's amazing, right? But be just be really mindful of that because right, you know, not all of it is not all of it is really authentic.
SPEAKER_00:That's a really that's a tough one because candidly very tough. Unless you have written a book for the exact same, exact same readers. Yep, you use the same cover designer, and you each have the same, you know what I mean? That it would take you literally hours to make the kind of comparisons to make sure it all lined up before it would ever be realistic to compare yourself to another author. There are just so many factors that are involved. And realistically, the ones that you are seeing that are celebrating these wins and sharing these wins, they were where you are right now at some point. They just weren't clouding that from the rooftop. So be mindful of that as well, you know.
SPEAKER_01:Exactly. It's uh it's kind of like when they talk about so I remember when Adele first first onto the scene, right? And everybody was just like, oh my gosh, she's an overnight success. Right, right. And that that's you know, and I I think she was actually asked at an interview one time and she just laughed. That literally never happens to anybody.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, exactly. You know, you know, even people that have a their quote unquote breakout book, they've written other things. You know what I mean? Just because they had a breakout, just because the a book was a quick success for a particular author that you may have read about or that actually made the news at one point or was a headline, they've written before that didn't go anywhere. You know what I mean? So just also keep that in mind that even big name household name authors that seem like they had a breakout moment, they had a lot of frustration, a lot of no's, a lot of duds. That's just part of life, candidly. You know?
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Um, you want to take the next one? I I I love this one. I mean, I have a lot to say because man, that's a tough one.
SPEAKER_00:Right. Each no is not is data, it's not defeat. And that is very hard, especially when I feel like you're getting a lot more no's than yeses. And that is something that we actually work with a lot of, you know, we talk through with a lot of our clients, um, you know, especially those that had big media plans, big media goals, things like this. And we had a client very recently that we had a fabulous conversation with in terms of reassessing what's working, what's not, what the barriers to entry may be. And they had a fantastic outlook on it and just said, you know, this is, you know, their response was from our feedback is that, yeah, this is telling me that X and Y are probably better options for me than Z going forward. Yeah. You know, I was like clapping at my desk because that is exactly the right attitude to have. You know, marketing is also a lot of testing. You know, nobody mark, nobody markets with the idea. Professional marketers don't market knowing we know this is 100% going to land with every single person we're intending to hit. No, marketing is also research, it's generating data, it's generating insight, it's learning, and it's what you do with that information that matters in the long run.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, exactly. And you have to reframe so, and it's not really just about reframing rejection, it's also about reframing the silence. So, this is something that I know a lot of authors really struggle with. Like, well, I pitched 20 people and I didn't hear from a single one, right? I'd have conversations with authors about this all the time. If they're doing their own marketing and they're really so typically, a sometimes people will tell you no, but sometimes they will just not respond. And that no response is a response, unfortunately, right? So don't take that personally either. It's just a matter of they get busy, they only take the, I mean, think about how we all are in email these days, right? It's like we all get so much, and we respond to the things that that are you know part of some project we're working on or something that impacts us or whatever that is, right? Um and I also think so creating expectation breaks I think after big launches, um just take take some time, give yourself some distance from analyzing, right? Because distance, and and I've seen this just, you know, when I was first in business, like I was very much like I want to just respond right away to everything, respond to every email. And one of the things that I learned a long time ago is that stepping away from something, something that is, you know, can confusing me or a problem I'm trying to work out or whatever it is, distance really creates clarity. And I it also does that, it also creates clarity for expectations. So don't be so tethered to your whole expectation mantra that you can't kind of step back and go for a walk or go to the park or something, you know, that you're not so you're not so focused because it also gives you a moment to kind of breathe. And part of the reason why, I mean, I think not just this is important, but this entire conversation is we have seen so many authors give up just short of the finish line, which is why this is so crucially important. Um, you want to take the next one?
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, so this is another really important one. And we talk about this a lot too with our clients. So marketing is a process of planting seeds, not hunting trophies. Yes. You know, I love that so much. That is such a great, powerful line. Because, and again, this happens. We, you know, it both fiction and nonfiction, there's different reasons, but we do regularly remind our clients that there are so many factors that come into play when people buy a new book. They're really not the impulse items people think they are based on the price point, most of the time. You know what I mean? So for fiction, usually people start looking for new books when they need a new book. You know, that is that is very real, or when they have a trip coming up or they know they have some free time, or because a friend recommended it randomly. People are typically not just constantly trolling for new books. And a couple of you listening might be like, oh, I am, but that's I guess I kind I kind of do that, but okay. And then the same thing for nonfiction too, especially for nonfiction, people typically buy nonfiction when they have a goal in mind that they're ready to act on. If they have a problem that they're looking to solve, like usually it's very much an intentional move to buy a nonfiction book, no matter what the topic is. And so, you know, we remind our clients, and this is if you're doing your own marketing as well, these are planting seeds. We're trying to plant seeds. So when whether it's fiction or nonfiction, when that person that is in your target market is actually starting to look for a book that suits their needs, they've already been introduced to your book in a few different ways. You know what I mean? That is our goal. That is our mission. And that should be yours too if you're doing your own marketing. You want to make sure that they've organically been introduced to your book through different channels, different platforms, you know what I mean, in different ways, because then you are top of mind when they start thinking about the next book they're going to buy or when they get ready to make that next move with whatever problem they're trying to solve or answer they're looking to find.
SPEAKER_01:Well, but the other thing, you know, I saw this meme the other day that said, you know, you wouldn't expect a tree to grow the minute you plant a seed, right? So uh that is all that is always an important analogy to kind of keep in mind too, is that a lot of what you're doing is seed planting, and which is part of the reason why we say, you know, you want to just start that seed planting as early as you can. If you're starting it on publication date, don't expect those to sprout on day two because that's just not that's just not the way that it works. The other thing that I want to mention, and I think maybe in closing is definitely revisit some of our other episodes because we've covered media, Amazon ads. If you're a new listener, first off, welcome. We love that you're here. Um, we but we've done shows, we've we're going, so next year will be our sixth year. I can't believe it. We've done shows on pretty much anything Amazon ads, influencer pitching, all the all the things. And and I think that it's just important to make sure that your expectations are actually aligning with the current marketplace and what the marketplace needs. And and one of the ways that you can also do that is so the Alliance of Independent Authors just had their conference. I'm actually listening to some of their some of the classes they did. They did a terrific job uh this year, as they always do. But, you know, start to attend some some writers' conferences, whether in person or virtual. That'll give you a really good, a better sense, I think, of what the, you know, what the marketplace, you know, what the marketplace needs. Um so, you know, Amy said this early on in the show. Success is consistency, right? Consistency and consistency in anything, you know, consist just consistently showing up, um focusing on your readers and not getting so hung up on the results that you may or may not be getting, right?
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, I think it's definitely I love this. Success is about control, isn't about control, it's about commitment. Yeah. You know, that is very much true. And that is one of the things. And we've mentioned this before, and I think it gets lost a lot that every marketing effort typically there's two or three additional things that you can do to support that. Does that make sense, Penny? Because it this feel.
